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Are we doomed by our own destruction?

Discussion in 'General Chit Chat' started by Anon04576, Jun 18, 2015.

  1. Anon04576
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    Anon04576 Well-Known Member

  2. Anon220806
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    Anon220806 Well-Known Member

  3. Timmers
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    Timmers Well-Known Member Trusted Member

    I don't believe any of it, small glimmers of the truth in the article that's all, having said that I wont be around in a hundred years to be proved wrong :)

    Good advertising by the Green party others may disagree :D
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  4. aposhark
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    aposhark Well-Known Member Lifetime Member

    Link............Too negative for me to get passed a couple of lines............
  5. Dave_E
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    Dave_E Well-Known Member Trusted Member

    I thought that the global warming lobby had been discredited.
  6. oss
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    oss Somewhere Staff Member

    No mate, that's just a fantasy that people cling to in order to avoid thinking about what will really happen.
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  7. Anon220806
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    Anon220806 Well-Known Member

    I suppose its easy to say it isnt happening, it wont happen. It wont affect me. So that we can go on as nothing is happening.

    I wonder what the future will hold for our offspring...

    I see the pope is speaking up on climate change right now.
  8. oss
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    oss Somewhere Staff Member

    I think my children may well have to live with a more realistic picture of what their parents, grandparents, great grandparents and so on have done to the world, but I think it will be their children that live to see the worst of it.

    It is funny that in Pope Francis' encyclical he wants us to reverse technological innovation but still won't recognise that breeding more and more people is the root cause of this developing Malthusian catastrophe.

    Will post more later.
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  9. Anon04576
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    Anon04576 Well-Known Member

    It is a negative outlook and you only have to walk past street preachers with a mere disinterested dismissal of their rants. Don't worry, we all do it because they spout out non-factual information but, more importantly, because we don't care nor have time. We don't care nor have time because it doesn't affect us does it?

    No it doesn't affect us, its already been stated here. Maybe even if we were presented by guaranteed factual evidence by the brightest minds or the most powerful computers, would we be affected? No we wouldn't. Our world is cyclic by nature and that cyclic nature is an intrinsic part of us. We live for around 70+ years or so on average. Do you care what happens after your life finishes? Of course you hope your children, or your children's children have a happy and prosperous life. What about your children's children's children? You don't know them, you may well never know them. How long can you fear for a family you will never meet, even if blood related?

    Let's make the assumption that the world is going to end with catastrophic effect in 100 or 200 years and if we changed our habits we could avoid catastrophe. I mean massive cuts in consumption of energy as the primary goal. Could we as a world do that? I don't think we would stand a chance. Would we even attempt it? No me thinks.

    Do some people care not to engage in such a discussion out of fear, out of selfishness, ignorance or just don't give a hoots anyhow?

    Its a very subjective topic and interestingly most people dismiss it, even me, until I wrote these words.

    Will I think about it again? Yes but only in passing and only in passing because I'm an average human being who won't be affected!

    Low batt na lang :)
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  10. Anon220806
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    Anon220806 Well-Known Member

    I suspect the fullest impacts will be further downstream. But in the meantime I suspect that some of our species in some parts of the world will be at the sharp end sometime soon.

    Ironically the Philippines is prime fodder for the effects.

    Even if many on here will not be here in the more distant future, many of our wives and gfs will and they will see our offspring in later life and their quality of life.

    On the Philippines:

    http://wwf.org.ph/climate-solutions

    Oss seems to think it is too late. I tend to think it isnt too late and the ship can be steered back on course. Notably its not the type of thing you want to say "I told you so" as the lessons learned will be harsh.
    Last edited: Jun 18, 2015
  11. Timmers
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    Timmers Well-Known Member Trusted Member

    For the human race it is good that we cannot see what is in store for us in the distant future, at the absolute worst I can only see an all out nuclear war ending life as we know it in the West at least, even then the developing countries are unlikely to be affected, they will then become first world countries, the Philippines would then become the new USA :)
  12. Anon220806
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    Anon220806 Well-Known Member

    Did you ever read the book "On the Beach"?
  13. Timmers
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    Timmers Well-Known Member Trusted Member

    Pray enlighten me :D
  14. Anon220806
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    Anon220806 Well-Known Member

    "On the Beach is a 1957 post-apocalyptic novel written by British-Australian author Nevil Shute after he emigrated to Australia. The novel details the experiences of a mixed group of people in Melbourne as they await the arrival of deadly radiation spreading towards them from the northern hemisphere following a nuclear war a year previously. As the radiation approaches each person deals with their impending death in different ways.

    Shute's initial story appeared as a four-part series The Last Days on Earth in the London weekly periodical Sunday Graphic in April 1957. For the novel Shute expanded on the storyline. The story has been adapted twice as a film (in 1959 and 2000) and as a BBC radio broadcast in 2008."
  15. Timmers
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    Timmers Well-Known Member Trusted Member

    Looks like the sort of film I would enjoy, I don't have the patience to read the book.
  16. oss
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    oss Somewhere Staff Member

    The energy requirements of 1o or 11 billion souls are clearly much greater than 7 billion souls or 1 billion souls.

    Ten or eleven billion souls is almost a certainty now, resources will be be depleted ever more rapidly as we approach that kind of population, as we do approach it however more and more of us will be elderly and there may well be a rapid correction back down to 7 billion or less in mid 22nd century.

    If as many think we are headed for a climate disaster at the same time then we will probably experience a population collapse maybe as low as 1 billion but at the same time Pope Francis will get his desire and we will lose much of the technology that makes modern life fun for the privileged wealthy middle classes.

    The only reason we have not experienced a major Malthusian resource catastrophe so far is that technology has revolutionised agriculture and we got lucky and found several hundred million years worth of fossilised sunlight under the ground, just to be sure I mean oil without that fossil light nothing we have in the modern world would be possible with the population we have, and I mean nothing.

    Indeed without the oil we would not have the current population, we would have hit the buffers long ago.

    It is incredibly clear to me at least that a technological civilisation only gets one chance, because it looks like they only get technology from exploiting a a one time fossil energy resource, a resource that is essential for an expanding population but a resource that in supporting a large population also irreparably damages the environment that supports that population, and once that fossil light is gone we don't get any more for another 100 million years or so.

    We are in a race to solve the energy issue, without power we can't support the agriculture required for the current or future population, but if we exploit the fossil power we will continue poison the planet that keeps us all alive in the first place.

    The world is no longer a big place, we have been everywhere, we have influenced everything, we have been incredibly ingenious at improving crop yields and at moving stuff around the world but there are limits, there is a great big wall up there in the distance and we are approaching it at breakneck speed like teenagers in hotrod's playing chicken to see who will brake first.

    No matter how optimistic we want to be, without clean energy we won't have this world of technology in 100 years time and if we keep on with fossil energy then we won't have this world of technology in 100 years time, catch 22.

    Are there solutions, yes there probably are, Thorium could fix a lot of it, Fusion could too but fusion if it ever comes will come too late although it might support an enclave of the modern world somewhere on the globe.

    Thorium won't be accepted because all nuclear is stigmatised already, renewable's will help but won't be enough, all that is certain is that we can't keep burning carbon and that is a certainty Dave!

    The problem is people there are too many of us, can we continue the technological miracle, I hope so, will we, I doubt it or if we do it will be too late for too many people and their families.

    The future is not bright and we only get one go at this, if we solve it then we will probably reach the stars one day, if we don't well that's probably typical for emerging species and the reason why we've found the skies to be pretty silent. It has been estimated that a galaxy would take a space capable species about 50,000 years to colonise and that is at sub light speeds, kind of tells you what the fate of technological civilisations tends to be.
    Last edited: Jul 4, 2015
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  17. Timmers
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    Timmers Well-Known Member Trusted Member

    I better not put any long playing records on Jim you obviously think we are doomed :D

  18. knightstrike
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    knightstrike Well-Known Member

    100 years into the future...

    I hope that Mars project would be up and running by then. Sir Richard Branson, stop chasing skirts and get a move on!

    Humanity needs you dear sir! Hahahahahha...
  19. Anon220806
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    Anon220806 Well-Known Member

    Good way of putting it.

    There is a good you tube video on the perils of consuming fossilised sunshine too quickly. But havent been able to locate it. I posted it on here some time back. It sums up nicely why we are likely to hit the wall as you describe.

    Found it. (I know you have seen it before Oss)


    "This vitally important documentary examines the science behind how oil was created over billions of years and how it is being depleted in just over one hundred years. It also looks at the environmental consequences of oil depletion."



    It is well over an hour long. But needs to be to get the ideas across. Carbon dioxide, hydrocarbons (oil and gas) and warm climates....its all there. Why is so much of the worlds oil in the middle east and much much more.

    It is my opinion that we are still learning on this subject matter and rapidly and it wont be long before what we are hearing now, becomes widely accepted, the world over. Our collective understanding is improving fast. We have had the Stone Age, the Bronze Age, the Iron Age and we are in the Oil Age. Will the next be the Green Age?
    Last edited: Jun 19, 2015
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  20. Anon220806
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    Anon220806 Well-Known Member

    We are if we dont do something about it in good time.
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