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New girl, about to have Pinoy baby

Discussion in 'Introduce Yourself' started by Tansy, Dec 4, 2018.

  1. Tansy
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    Tansy New Member

    Hi everyone I’m british, currently here in the UK, my fiancé is Filipino and we are expecting a baby in 8 days! We are/ were both seafarers, and spent majority of our time on land in the Philippines. But have taken almost a year off work and are based here in the UK enjoying the benefits of the nhs for our pregnancy. My fiancé is still battling with his annulment, and realistically can’t see us getting married till 2020 earliest. He is on his 2nd tourist visa at the moment, and when that expires i am not sure how we will get him back.
    My question is actually regarding our baby, I obviously want dual citizenship for our child and have been looking at papers etc I need to submit, one of which asks for the middle name of the baby which should be my maiden name. Of course we do things differently here and the middle name is just a name. I’m really in two minds about using my last name on our British birth certificate, our son will definatly have his fathers last name but I have read about people having trouble with immigration etc when their baby has different surname to their mother. We are scheduled to return to Phil with baby in March and then assumibh we haven’t fixed anyway for my fiancé to return to the UK with me I will be travelling alone with an Asian baby with a different last name, and understand I may be seen a baby snatcher. Does anyone have any experience with travelling with a child with different last name? Should I use both of our last names just for the sake of a few years of travelling, my last name is two sylables and my fiancé’s is three and it seems like a massive mouthful. And finally if I do decide not to use my last name for our baby, do I still put it in the form when registering our baby with the Filipino embassy, assuming then it would appear in his Filipino passport and not his British passport?
    I’m sorry this is such a massive first post. I hope someone has some similar experience.
  2. Br28016
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    Br28016 Member

    As you noted lots of people have trouble traveling with a child with different surname so would be very careful on that one. Will need to travel with birth certificate most of the time.

    If aiming for dual citizenship also need to consider uk passport policy if have different names in passports. Should aim for same name in all passports and birth certificates. Otherwise may have problems getting British passport.

    https://www.gov.uk/government/publications/change-of-name-guidance

    When you mentioned your partner was seeking annulment did wonder about law on adultary.

    https://famli.blogspot.com/2006/01/adultery-concubinage-and-psychological.html

    Not something we would think about in the UK but the philippines is a bit different. Probably not a real worry based on link below.

    https://lifestyle.inquirer.net/36413/ortigas-madrigal-case-breaks-silence-on-concubinage/
  3. Mattecube
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    Mattecube Glad i did it Trusted Member

    You are going to have to tread very carefully with your Fiancee when you return home as he is still married and now has a child by you, how the Philippines will look at that I wouldnt like to call!
    You may need an a Travel Consent Form from the other parent (your fiancee) to say he agrees with the child leaving the Philippines,regardless of the passport name of your child.
    When you do acquire 2 passports for the child I would ensure that both passport names are the same (different names may arouse suspicion unless the childs name in Filipino includes the Tagalog Ng or Ñ then having different names maybe ok
  4. Markham
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    Markham . Lifetime Member

    Yep, the laws on adultery will certainly apply and I assume that the OP realises that she will need to apply for a Settlement Visa for her child unless she's prepared to remain in the Philippines whilst awaiting the child's British Passport.
  5. Br28016
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    Br28016 Member

    Should really have said congratulations - exciting times and best wishes for the future.

    They are in UK now so will need UK passport to leave. So that is one less thing to worry about.

    Philippines law splits into adultary (married woman and other man) and concubinage (woman and married man).

    Legal side prior to annulment was one of the things I was worried about but having read about the law including the links I originally posted it seems the law is somewhat one sided and tougher on the scenario of married women cheating on husband's rather than married husbands cheating on wife's. Not so sure if legally separated makes a difference or if OP partner is in that situation but has potential to give his wife leverage in an annulment process and settlement agreements so should consider that.

    Think definitely want to make things low key when in philippines.

    I remember newspaper articles of Brits having problems with adultary complaints but that was for men who had met up with philippine women (adultary) as opposed to women who had met up with filipino men (concubinage). Only link the other way I found was below.

    https://www.philstar.com/banat/cebu-news/2016/04/29/1578325/legal-affair

    Law seems a bit one sided but you are on the better side of it. I think a complaint has to be made so if stay low key probably ok and standard to meet for concubinage is higher.

    As you are not married I believe the father does not have parental responsibility so can't block child leaving. Don't believe under philippines law even being named on birth certificate gives parental responsibility. It does under uk law but whether they would apply than standard in the Philippines is debatable. Searching around for travel clearance info found the link below.

    https://www.philippine-embassy.org.sg/the-philippines-2/dswd-travel-clearance-for-filipino-minors-2/

    • Illegitimate children
    The Family Code of the Philippines vests the mother with the parental authority over an illegitimate child (Article 176).

    1. If travelling with the mother, a DSWD travel clearance is not required.
    2. If travelling with a person other than the mother, a DSWD travel clearance is required.
    3. If travelling with the biological father, a DSWD travel clearance is required. However, if a Court Order has granted parental authority to the father, a DSWD travel clearance is not required.
    4. If travelling with an adult other than the mother, a DSWD travel clearance is required.
    Might be worth getting a CENOMAR for you in the Philippines to prove you are not married to go with the birth certificate to prove child is illegitimate and you are the mother.

    Not sure if child could have problems with regards to CFO requirements for children although should enter with British passport as will take time to get philippines passport so when exiting with British passport should keep the child off that radar. If you have philippines passport by them could enter with that which means baby is not limited to normal 30 days limit without need for visa extensions. As baby is under 2 would not be liable for travel tax on leaving.

    Will probably need NSO birth certificate which will take time. Would probably be faster to do birth registration for that in philippines as embassy takes long time to transmit details to philippines. Not sure if do registration here and apply for philippines passport in London if they do things any faster. Time to get philippines passport in UK (12 weeks) means may still be faster to do all of it in philippines if staying long enough. If do birth registration quickly then may be able to it all in UK especially if they will accept uk birth certificate for passport application or the Philippines embassy registration.

    Not particularly romantic but may make things safer to do do child's surname in your name only and consider not having your partner on birth certificate to avoid evidence of concubinage. Then do the tidy up after the annulment and marriage.
  6. Tansy
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    Tansy New Member

    Wow firstly thank you all for such an abundance of information I never expected so much feedback, i think I will have to reread a little as I’m experiencing information overload. Our little one has not yet vacated his hotel room, so haven’t had to do battle with brith certificates / reports yet.

    Im not to concerned about the annulment (I hope I’m not being naive) as his ex wife is in China living with her girlfriend, she has no interest remaining married and will inherit half the value of the house, once annulment is finalised. Thank you once again for all the information I will have another read and pass on to me fella so he is armed with facts. In regards to keeping things low key, we have not advertised our relationship to his lawyer not because we are trying to be deceptive but because I’m horribly sceptical and thought the very expensive annulment cost might increase with knowledge of a foreigner mistress. I realise I have just contradicted myself and am trying to be deceptive. Eurgh. Sorry.

    Currently my most pressing concern is these forms, on the report of birth I will need to submit to the Philippines embassy no. 3 states CHILDS MIDDLE NAME then followed by mother’s maiden name in brackets.

    This is where my confusion lies, in order to make all the documents uniform, does my surname become what we in the UK would call a middle name, do I make it a double barrelled surname. The UK birth certificate has all names in one box with the surname I believe being put in capitals. If my fiancé travels with our baby I don’t want him to have issues at immigration either. I think I’m making this way more confusing than it needs to be.

    Thank you all so much for your time information and advice! And will definitely not be leaving UK without birth certificate. Applying for his Filipino passport whist in the Philippines is an idea I will certainly look into more! But with the ease of the location of the embassy here does make things a lot easier. 12 weeks for Phil passport is really tight if he comes on time, but could fly out later for convenience of doing it here. So much to think about. I can’t thank you all enough!
  7. Br28016
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    Br28016 Member

    Not a lawyer but always worth educating myself. Had a look and think the key word is legitimate. Second link details who is illegitimate and this situation falls under heading 1 or 4 in terms of illegitimate. For the philippines as a foreigner dont agree with classifying a child as legitimate or illegitimate but not my country so dont get to decide on it. Naming on birth certificate allows child to use fathers surname and seek support but think that is it under philippines law but again always useful to know more. Way different under UK law when father gets rights being named on birth certificate. International element makes things more complicated as dont know enough law to know which counties laws have jurisdiction.

    Thinking some more if priority is dual nationality then father will need to be named to get the Philippines passport and has to be at birth. If this is priority then probably best to use philippines naming convention and use mothers name as middle name and fathers as surname. I did some searching and could not find any restrictions on uk naming convention on birth certificates. Advantages are no issues with UKPO if has second passport, mothers surname is on passport so minimises issues when going through passport control in any country. Still worth doing as in your link carrying a birth certificate with passport when travelling.

    Being named on birth certificate would help help I'm sure in a future settlement visa application.

    Just have to roll the dice on adultary/concubinage rules as baby passport and birth certificate would be evidence against them if it became a problem.

    Concern I had with CFO is that I thought all filipino needed sticker and if over 13 had to do course but under 13 just needed sticker. Not sure if the CFO requirement applies - would not need visa and supposed to cover filipinos with visas but worth checking if thinking of using filipino passport to exit country.

    Section A. In General
    Aart. 17.Joint Parental Authority. - The father and mother shall exercise jointly just and reasonable parental authority and responsibility over their legitimate or adopted children. In case of disagreement, the father's decision shall prevail unless there is a judicial order to the contrary.

    In case of the absence or death of either parent, the present or surviving parent shall continue to exercise parental authority over such children, unless in case of the surviving parent's remarriage, the court, for justifiable reasons, appoints another person as guardian.

    In case of separation of his parents, no child under five years of age shall be separated from his mother unless the court finds compelling reasons to do so.

    https://psa.gov.ph/civilregistration/legitimation

    Who are considered illegitimate children?

    The following are illegitimate children :

    1. Children born to couples who are not legally married or of common-law marriages;
    2. Children born of incestuous marriages;
    3. Children born of bigamous marriages;
    4. Children born of adulterous relations between parents;
    5. Children born of marriages void for reason of public policy under Art. 38 of the Family Code;
    6. Children born of couples below 18, whether they are married (which married is void) or not; and,
    7. Children born of other void marriages under Art. 15 unless otherwise provided. (OCRG Cir. No. 89-13 dated July 17, 1989)
  8. Br28016
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    Br28016 Member

    Never going to claim I'm an expert but having checked the form I believe they are looking for your surname in that box

    Mother name: Tansy Mary Smith
    Fathers name: Thomas Cruz Santos

    Child Name: Arnold Smith Santos

    That is ideally what you set the uk birth certificate to in order to make the names the same in both.

    Law in the Philippines is very specific on how names are done. Father has to acknowledge birth for child to use his surname. Middle name in that case is mothers surname. You get to select first name and have seen two names get in first name box but dont think they like that e.g.

    First name: Arnold thomas
    Middle name: smith
    Surname: santos

    Congratulations and hope all goes well.

    Based on what you added dont think the adultary laws are likely to be an issue as does not sound like anyone is likely to raise complaints but do bear in mind in case of problems. It is an opportunity for people to make life difficult.

    Would think about getting legal advice on parental responsibility as your fiance would require travel clearance as he falls into the category below for illegitimate child leaving philippines. For UK purposes the uk birth certificate gives it. Other countries laws are potentially different.

    If travelling with the biological father, a DSWD travel clearance is required. However, if a Court Order has granted parental authority to the father, a DSWD travel clearance is not required
    Last edited: Dec 8, 2018 at 2:14 PM
  9. oss
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    oss Not Here

    What are you on about, this is a female British citizen, in Britain having her child with the support of the NHS in Britain, the kid is BRITISH, what kind of Settlement Visa applies to this circumstance, good god.

    Children of British women have always been automatically British, it was only in 2006 that children of British men also acquired that right.

    Yes adultery laws apply, in the Philippines.

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